The Trump Presidency

Bandit wrote:

ford plasko wrote:

Ain't going to happen. 3,000,000 possible Democrat voters will only draw them closer to statehood.

They will never get statehood.

I just read today that even though they voted for the referendum, many in the opposition refused to vote. We'll see. I can't see us propping up the territory without a substantial return i.e. Blue state voters and the Electoral College bump that would pretty much guarantee a democrat president in the future.

eber322 wrote:

Yeah, it has some strategic value, not sure how significant it is in todays world. Don't see how it will prevent another missile crisis, after all it didn't prevent the last one.

Still significant, as the US is actually present in the Caribbean. Back in the 60's we were not. The island is also the largest air hub in the Caribbean, even larger than Cuba. Its port facilities can handle even an aircraft carrier. But the Navy already built a base there. So they don't use the civilian ports.

Bandit wrote:

Still significant, as the US is actually present in the Caribbean. Back in the 60's we were not.

Huh? Puerto Rico has been a US territory since 1898. We took it from Spain in the Spanish American war. Same time we took control of Cuba, though stupidly we didn't keep it.

ford plasko wrote:

I just read today that even though they voted for the referendum, many in the opposition refused to vote. We'll see. I can't see us propping up the territory without a substantial return i.e. Blue state voters and the Electoral College bump that would pretty much guarantee a democrat president in the future.

Don't buy into the propaganda by either party. First off, all they can do, is vote in the Presidential Primaries. And the Democrats lost. Less than 100K voted.

Allow me to throw some numbers at you.

My state has a population of over 10 million. We have a GDP of around 537B and a debt of about 48B. Our debt wouldn't be so high, except for natural disasters. As I posted above, the Feds won't help.

PR has a population of over 3 million, and a GDP of 103B. Yet they have a debt of over 70B, even though we give them 21B in Federal Aid every year.

Still think they ever will be a state?

eber322 wrote:

Huh? Puerto Rico has been a US territory since 1898. We took it from Spain in the Spanish American war. Same time we took control of Cuba, though stupidly we didn't keep it.

Was the US military there? Back in 1898?

Bandit wrote:

Was the US military there? Back in 1898?

Yeah, you can read about the Puerto Rican Campaign of the Spanish American War. The other major campaign was of course the Cuban campaign.

Not at all what I mean. There was no significant military presence on the island. What may have been there in the 1890's is meaningless. it would be another 30 years before they even got citizenship. We were talking about 70 years in the future. 1962 and how they helped prevent another missile crisis.

Read about Roosevelt Roads Naval Station and you'll understand. There was nothing close to that ever on the island.

You've completely lost me. You claimed Puerto Rico being a US territory helps prevent another missile crisis, I said it didn't prevent the first one. You then ask if the US had military there in 1898, I replied we've had a military presence there since 1898. You then brought up Roosevelt Roads Naval Station saying; "There was nothing close to that ever on the island." Um.... there was EXACTLY that on the island from the 50's until 2004. Meaning it was there during the missile crisis and didn't prevent it. Now that it isn't there, how could it possibly prevent another one?

We had a military presence there in 1962, including Roosevelt Roads Naval Station and they didn't prevent the missile crisis. We have a military presence there now and have less reason to think they can prevent another missile crisis now. Somehow, you've ended up arguing my point for me. Puerto Rico didn't prevent the first missile crisis and has no chance of preventing one now.

You are losing yourself. There was never anything on the Island like this in 1962 or before that.

I still can't believe Puerto Rico is blaming Trump. Here's an example:

Link

Is it his fault you can't get to the aid he freaking sent?

This is exactly what Trump meant when he said they want everybody to do everything for them.

Bandit wrote:

I still can't believe Puerto Rico is blaming Trump. Here's an example:

Link

Is it his fault you can't get to the aid he freaking sent?

This is exactly what Trump meant when he said they want everybody to do everything for them.

They have created the nanny state there. They cannot do anything themselves. If this was Texas, West Virginia we would be doing it ourselves.

Bandit wrote:

You are losing yourself. There was never anything on the Island like this in 1962 or before that.

All of your besides the point comments aside, Roosevelt Roads Naval Station was the biggest military installation on Puerto Rico. And it existed in 1962. Now it doesn't. So to actually address the point, they couldn't prevent a missile crisis when the Navel base was there 1962, and they certainly can't prevent one now when they don't even have one.


BTW: That top photo you posted? That's Norfolk Navel Base in Virginia circa 2012.



Here's a link to a bigger image where you can see it's the same place from the other side. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/eb/9_Flattops_at_Norfolk_naval_base%2C_December_20%2C_2012.jpg/1920px-9_Flattops_at_Norfolk_naval_base%2C_December_20%2C_2012.jpg

Pissedoffvulcan wrote:

They have created the nanny state there. They cannot do anything themselves. If this was Texas, West Virginia we would be doing it ourselves.

The US Government didn't make them so dependent. The Puerto Rican Government did. They're also the ones that got themselves so in debt.

As for the other states and territories, agree totally.

eber322 wrote:

All of your besides the point comments aside, Roosevelt Roads Naval Station was the biggest military installation on Puerto Rico. And it existed in 1962. Now it doesn't. So to actually address the point, they couldn't prevent a missile crisis when the Navel base was there 1962, and they certainly can't prevent one now when they don't even have one.


BTW: That top photo you posted? That's Norfolk Navel Base in Virginia circa 2012.

I suspected you were searching the Internet for info. Now I know you are. Yes, it is Norfolk. I'm stunned you had to look it up on the net, when you can clearly see 5 Nimitz Class carriers in port right next to each other. No other place in the world can do that. After this post, my discussion with you is over. All you know is what you can find on the Internet.

Roosevelt Roads was created in 1943. It was just an airstrip and not even paved. Until the late 50's it went through periods of opening and closing due to WW2, Korean War, and other more important concerns. In the late 50's it was changed to a Naval Station and started major improvements. It's primary mission was reconnaissance, ASW and SAR of the Caribbean.

In 1961 while on a routine recon, they discovered a Soviet Naval convoy under armed escort headed to Cuba. The rest as they say, is history. As for After Roads closed, I'm not going into that. It has nothing to do with Trumps Presidency.

Bandit wrote:

As for After Roads closed, I'm not going into that. It has nothing to do with Trumps Presidency.

Lol No, what it has to do with is you claiming that today Puerto Rico is preventing another missile crisis. You didn't even know that Roosevelt Roads has been closed since 2004. You then, as you put it, went "searching the Internet for info" and found a Chinese website that mislabeled Norfolk as Roosevelt Roads and posted that thinking it was Roosevelt. Unlike you I knew Roosevelt was long closed, and I knew that picture was of Norfolk. And all I went looking for was another picture to prove that to you. As for "searching the internet for info", that's exactly what YOU were doing when you found the fake Chinese site.

All said, all your BS and making yourself look completely foolish aside, you've proved my point.... Puerto Rico being a territory isn't preventing anything, let alone another missile crisis.

Bandit wrote:

After this post, my discussion with you is over. All you know is what you can find on the Internet.

Says the guy who knows nothing about this other than what he found on a fake Chinese site on the internet. Seriously at this point I feel bad for you, you should have just stopped after your last nonsense post, instead you keep digging yourself deeper. I'll tell you what, I'M DONE TALKING WITH YOU about this. At a certain point it's no longer funny to watch somebody make a fool of themselves.

Politics. Politics. Politics. That's all this Puerto Rico whining is about. I remember hurricane Andrew here in Florida. Total devastation. I'm pretty sure that it took just as long to get things cleared so help could get to residents. I scream every time they bring up how many are without electricity. You can't just fix a lot of these lines, they have to be replaced! Plus it's a whole lot easier to truck help in if you're not on an island that has from one end to the other been destroyed
 Anyway Andrew definitely cost Gov. Chiles and Pres. Bush approval numbers which is what the media hand wringing was meant to do.

I'm tired about hearing about Mueller and his stupid investigation. How much money is all of this costing tax payers?

Manafort and Gates were doing their shady stuff before even Obama was in office. And Papadopoulos was just a butt kisser trying to score big bucks.

Did any of this have anything to do with Trump? NO!

Bandit wrote:

I'm tired about hearing about Mueller and his stupid investigation. How much money is all of this costing tax payers?

Manafort and Gates were doing their shady stuff before even Obama was in office. And Papadopoulos was just a butt kisser trying to score big bucks.

Did any of this have anything to do with Trump? NO!

Here is an interesting tid bit. Mueller might not be able to press charges against manafort. Because it beyond the scope of his investigation and what he is allowed to do. A judge could very well tell them that you can turn it over the DOJ but you cannot prosecute.
Another one is if any information was obtained by the unmasking that evidence might be thrown out because Samantha Powers has said that her name was used illegally in front of congress. So the evidence would have been obtained illegally. It will be interesting to watch.

Funny how quiet the Democrats and media got over Trump, North Korea and Nukes. Understandable though. North Korea themselves just made liars out of all of them.

Well it was bound to happen. I actually disagree with something Trump did. Very much so in fact. I have no clue what was going through his mind when he called Africa a bunch of s***hole countries. They are anything but. Yes, many extremely underdeveloped, or not developed at all, but that's what makes them so important. 30% plus of the worlds most valuable natural resources come from them. They have only been tapped in the last 60 years, while others remain untapped. Were talking about over 50 different nations, and several thousand different languages.

They have the most expensive everything on the planet. Most cannot be found elsewhere, or are/is already tapped out. Gold, Silver, Platinum, Copper, Aluminium, Titanium, Nickle, Iron, Uranium, Cobalt, Phosphates, Graphite, Diamonds, Emeralds, Rubies, Sapphires, Pearls, Oil, Natural Gas, Lumber, Tobacco, Sea Food, the list goes on and on. Over 3 times larger than the entire U.S., and they have hundreds of thousands or millions tons of what I listed plus.

From an economic viewpoint, look at Africa like this:

Link to map

The U.S. has a considerable investment in all those resources. That's why we have the military there. To prevent warlords, terrorists or some other a-holes from threatening our investment.

Then our POTUS calls every nation on the continent a s***hole nation. Can you say bye-bye investment? Trump better hope they all have thick skins...

If I'm correct in what I read, he asked why we were taking in people from these sh#thole countries. That to me is even more offensive. We should welcome all immigrants as long as they enter legally from countries judged to be our allies

When we would pull into certain ports we considered them s holes. But hey were sailors so we used a lot of colorful language. Trump should have been more diplomatic and said why are we bringing in low skilled labor from countries that are less than desirable. Because once you get out of the tourist traps they are S holes. I have helped with humanitarian efforts in some of those countries and it is not a good place.

When we would pull into certain ports we considered them s holes. But hey were sailors so we used a lot of colorful language. Trump should have been more diplomatic and said why are we bringing in low skilled labor from countries that are less than desirable. Because once you get out of the tourist traps they are S holes. I have helped with humanitarian efforts in some of those countries and it is not a good place.

I was in Haiti for a mission and relief trip back in 1987. It was an eye opening experience. Poverty doesn't even start to explain the conditions I saw. But for the most part the people were friendly, industrious and hopeful that someday things would get better. Was it a bad place to live? Oh yeah. But to say we don't want immigrants from there is sending ill will that makes for resentful neighbors.

Now I'm reading that Sen. Durbin was the one who started this rumor. He's been known to tell tall tales

“In a ‘negotiation’ meeting with the president, one GOP House Leader told the president: ‘I cannot even stand to look at you,’” Durbin wrote in a post on his Facebook page over the weekend.

So like everything else coming out of Washington:It's probably a lie. :affraid:

Well the Democrats are 0 for 2 so far. They blew it with the shutdown, and lost again when Trump gave an outstanding SOTU speech.

Sadly though, the Democrats will NOT work with the Republicans or Trump on anything. I hope the speech fired up the Republicans to take the mid-terms seriously. If they lose the House, nothing significant as far as legislature will happen. Either way the battleground has been set.