Post your evidence that Obama is not a U.S. Citizen.

Ok I found this little Gem.

http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/barackobama/a/obama_citizenship_questioned.htm

But this has been proven false.

Actually that story is based on what is suspected to be true. It is know that Barry Soetoro is his legal name. It is know that he was adopted by an Indonesian and moved there. Further it is know that at that time they didn't allow US citizens go to school in that country.

Because of that people suspect he was made an Indonesian citizen and his school financial aid papers would reveal what nationality he applied under. But of course, just like with his birth certificate, Obama has spent millions to keep his college records sealed.

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

Definite proof Obama was born here.

Pissedoffvulcan wrote:

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

Definite proof Obama was born here.

I hope you're kidding. That isn't a Birth certificate, it's a certification of birth. It doesn't list what doctor delivered him or what hospital he was born in. In fact it doesn't even prove he was born anywhere in Hawaii. Hawaii issues Certifications of Birth to foreign born children if one of their parents is an Hawaiian citizen. All it proves is that his mother was a citizen and registered his birth in Hawaii.

What about the news announcements?

But if you read what it actually says it says Certificate of Live Birth.

By golly you might be right here is a picture of a Birth certificate

http://snarkybytes.com/?p=521

I know I'm right. A certificate of live birth, certification of birth, whatever. Different states word it differently. It still isn't a Birth Certificate, and the Hawaii one is the worst one of any state. Because they leave off all the vital info and give them to babies not born in Hawaii without stating that.

For example, I don't have an actual copy of my Birth Certificate. I have a certificate of live birth issued by MI. Difference is my state includes the name of the doctor who signed it, the date he signed it. The father, and if different, mothers address. The name and address of the hospital where born. And when my father got this copy the County Clerk for the county I was born in signed it swearing that the info was true and matched the actual B.C. Mine contains ALL of the info from the B.C. except for footprint.

Mine is a legal substitute for a B.C. to get a federal ID and US passport. The HI one isn't, because it lacks information, and it's known that they issue the same form to kids born outside of the state of Hawaii. When they list town, county, etc of birth, they are really listing where it was applied for.

Pissedoffvulcan wrote:

What about the news announcements?

What about it? It doesn't state where he was born, simply that he was. Birth, death, and marriage announcements are posted all the time in other towns or states than where they occur, simply because of family or friends in that area listing it. A high school friend of mine moved to CA from MI. When he got married his mother posted an announcement in the local paper because of all the people around here who knew him. If he has kids, I'm sure she'll post that as well.

In the FactCheck.org story is specifically states that the form you get when you request a copy of your birth certificates is a short form of the actual certificate and that it does not include some details of the birth such as birth weight and other things. Hawaiian officials have reviewed Obama's documents and have stated unequivicolably that he was born in Hawaii. Numerous federal judges have thrown all the birther lawsuits saying that they have no merit. Give it up people. I think the right needs their own version of Moveon.org.

Samurai

Lol. Factcheck is a biased liberal organization that is full of crap. They have posted two different Certificates for Obama. The first one they apparently created themselves, then after Obama's Campaign released a different one, they change the one on their site to the campaigns.

No federal judge has "thrown" anything out because of lack of merit. They have all refused to hear the cases on lack jurisdiction, saying that it is a matter for the Supreme Court. The Supreme Court has refused to hear the cases period. There have been no rulings beyond "this is a case for the Supreme Court", and they have completely ignored the issue.

Two Hawaiian officials have said they saw his Birth Certificate. The first never said it was an Hawaiian Birth Certificate. The second official, which was only within the last year, said it was an Hawaiian birth certificate. Since then another official, who is a big Obama supporter, has come forward saying Obama WAS NOT born in Hawaii and all the government people there know it. He then goes on to say it doesn't matter because the Constitution was written a long time ago and should be ignored now.

None of which matters anyway since his Father was a UK citizen, Obama isn't and never was or could have been a Natural Born Citizen even if he was born in Hawaii.

Oh, and you can get a copy of your actual Birth Certificate. You simply have to tell them you want an actual long form copy. If you don't they give you the Certificate by default.

eber322 wrote:

Lol. Factcheck is a biased liberal organization that is full of crap. They have posted two different Certificates for Obama. The first one they apparently created themselves, then after Obama's Campaign released a different one, they change the one on their site to the campaigns.

Isn't it funny when there is a source that disproves your point they are somehow biased. What about National Review Online? That big liberal orginization concurred with FactCheck that the certificate was genuine.

Quote :

Two Hawaiian officials have said they saw his Birth Certificate. The first never said it was an Hawaiian Birth Certificate. The second official, which was only within the last year, said it was an Hawaiian birth certificate. Since then another official, who is a big Obama supporter, has come forward saying Obama WAS NOT born in Hawaii and all the government people there know it. He then goes on to say it doesn't matter because the Constitution was written a long time ago and should be ignored now.

Which two officials? And who is this mysterious Obama supporter that came forward?

Quote :

None of which matters anyway since his Father was a UK citizen, Obama isn't and never was or could have been a Natural Born Citizen even if he was born in Hawaii.

Actually no. If you are born on U.S. soil and at least one of your parents are a natural born citizen you are a natural born citizen. Even if the other parent isn't. And I did say NATURAL born and not NATIVE born. Obama is and always has been a NATURAL BORN CITIZEN. Deal with it.

Samurai

Samurai wrote:

Isn't it funny when there is a source that disproves your point they are somehow biased. What about National Review Online? That big liberal orginization concurred with FactCheck that the certificate was genuine.

Factcheck never disproved anything. They are part of a group that Obama worked for, he was their superior in that organization. As far as NRO goes, nice try but I'm not blindly Conservative either. The NRO is full of crap, they are supporting his Certificate for one reason only, McCain also isn't a Natural Born citizen so they, like most Republicans, can't and won't speak out against Obama on this issue. They have an article there in support of Obamas Cert that proves they are liars or simply incompetent. They say the Cert has ALL the same info as a long form Birth Certificate, that is blatantly false. A long form has the doctors name and signature, hospital name, etc none of which Obamas Cert has.

Samurai wrote:

Which two officials? And who is this mysterious Obama supporter that came forward?

One of them was the director of Hawaii's Department of Health, Chiyome Fukino, who said they had a Birth Certificate on file for him but never said it was an Hawaiian BC. This is important because Hawaii accepts BC's from other states and countries in order to issue Certificates of Birth, just like Obamas, as long as the parents are Hawaiian residents.

The other, and the only one to claim he has a Hawaiian BC, is Governor Linda Lingle. She came out more recently claiming she had her people go and verify he was born in Hawaii. Then she proceeded to lie and say that he was born in Kapi'olani Hospital in Honolulu just like Fukino had already said. Problem is, Fukino, never said he was born there or anywhere. All she said was they had a BC on file. Not to mention that Kapi'olani Hospital records had already been checked and they had no record of his birth there.

Samurai wrote:

Actually no. If you are born on U.S. soil and at least one of your parents are a natural born citizen you are a natural born citizen. Even if the other parent isn't. And I did say NATURAL born and not NATIVE born. Obama is and always has been a NATURAL BORN CITIZEN. Deal with it.

ACTUALLY NO. If you are born in the US to one US citizen you are a citizen, but not Natural Born. Just like if you are born on foreign soil to one, or two, US citizens you are a citizen but NOT a Natural Born one. You're referring to the 14th amendment which says "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States." They are citizens, but not Natural Born, do to this Amendment. You have to have TWO US citizen parents AND be born on in the US it's territories or waters to be Natural Born. Even if that wasn't true, the Constitution says that if a child has dual citizenship his citizenship goes with that of the father.

Factcheck never disproved anything. They are part of a group that Obama worked for, he was their superior in that organization. As far as NRO goes, nice try but I'm not blindly Conservative either. The NRO is full of crap, they are supporting his Certificate for one reason only,

Quote :

McCain also isn't a Natural Born citizen so they, like most Republicans, can't and won't speak out against Obama on this issue. They have an article there in support of Obamas Cert that proves they are liars or simply incompetent. They say the Cert has ALL the same info as a long form Birth Certificate, that is blatantly false. A long form has the doctors name and signature, hospital name, etc none of which Obamas Cert has.

I am going to disagree with you on McCain. McCain was born in a US military hospital. Military bases are considered US sovereign territory. He was also born to two American citizens.

Pissedoffvulcan wrote:

I am going to disagree with you on McCain. McCain was born in a US military hospital. Military bases are considered US sovereign territory. He was also born to two American citizens.

Yes both his parents were US citizens, but Panama is not and, and never was, part of the US or a territory of the US. You have to have two US citizen parents AND be born in the US, it territores or waters to be Natural Born. And the only places outside of the US or its territories that are part of the US are US embassy's. Most US bases over seas are sovereign to US control by treaty and/or force of arms not because they are part of the US*. The US has purchased some bases out right, but not in Panama. Therefore he does not qualify.


*(For example look at Guantanamo Bay, it is legally part of Cuba. But the US has a lease on it from before Castro took over. The current Cuban government says the lease isn't valid and wants it back, but the US holds onto it by implied threat of force. Or look at Ramstein Air Base first occupied under threat of force after WWII, now occupied under treaty with Germany as part of the post war settlement. However, the land is still part of Germany. That is why they removed some nuclear weapons before the German reunification, part of that agreement, approved by the international community, said that nuclear weapons on German soil had to be limited. Now the German government is trying to demand we remove all nukes from their country. However, the post war agreement is open ended meaning that they can't evict us even though it's their land. It's rather like the open ended agreement we had with Panama to keep control of the lock even though Panama owned it, but then of course Carter like a dummy signed an end to that agreement.)

Quote :

And the only places outside of the US or its territories that are part of the US are US embassy's. Most US bases over seas are sovereign to US control by treaty and/or force of arms not because they are part of the US*. The US has purchased some bases out right, but not in Panama. Therefore he does not qualify.

But they are still considered Sovereign territory until said agreement is over. All United States laws apply. They under the same thing as Embassies are. And they are considered US Territory. A baby born aboard a US warship in a foreign port is considered a NBC. Same as with any military base.

Pissedoffvulcan wrote:

Quote :

And the only places outside of the US or its territories that are part of the US are US embassy's. Most US bases over seas are sovereign to US control by treaty and/or force of arms not because they are part of the US*. The US has purchased some bases out right, but not in Panama. Therefore he does not qualify.

But they are still considered Sovereign territory until said agreement is over. All United States laws apply. They under the same thing as Embassies are. And they are considered US Territory. A baby born aboard a US warship in a foreign port is considered a NBC. Same as with any military base.

They are not the same as embassy's. Embassy's are literally American soil, they are part of the US. Military bases are not, with the exception of the few the US owns outright. As I pointed out, Ramstein Air Base had to remove some nukes due to a German agreement, so atleast to some extent they are bound by foreign laws. They are not American soil. Children born there to one or more US citizens are citizens from birth, but not NB. Same with Navel vessels outside US waters.

EDIT:
Here you go. According to this embassy's don't count either. So even born in an embassy doesn't make you NB.

Quote :

The definition of the "United States", for nationality purposes, was expanded in 1952 to add Guam, and in 1986 it was expanded again to include the Northern Mariana Islands.[16] Persons born in these territories (in addition to Puerto Rico and the U.S. Virgin Islands) currently acquire U.S. citizenship at birth on the same terms as persons born in other parts of the United States. The category of "outlying possessions of the United States" (whose inhabitants generally have U.S. "nationality" but not U.S. "citizenship") is now restricted to American Samoa and Swains Island.[17][18] Regarding people born at U.S. military bases in foreign countries, current U.S. State Department policy (as codified in the department's Foreign Affairs Manual) reads:

"Despite widespread popular belief, U.S. military installations abroad and U.S. diplomatic or consular facilities are not part of the United States within the meaning of the 14th Amendment. A child born on the premises of such a facility is not subject to the jurisdiction of the United States and does not acquire U.S. citizenship by reason of birth."[19]

Wife bought a copy of the Globe Rage today (Aug.2 issue) and guess who's picture covers the front? You got obama and it is about his birth certificate again, this time they produce one from the province of Kenya. Obama Born in Africa this link only takes you to the basic story, unfortunately you have to get a copy of the Globe for the rest of the story (sounds like Paul Harvey).

P.S. pm me have digital copies also have a pdf file "FBI Admits Destorying File on Barack Obama's Grandfather Stanley Armour Dunham" This website USA Survival has a load of interesting documents.

Lol I seen that at K Mart yesterday.

I was talking to my friend at work from Kenya. Obama has pissed them off so bad that they now will not even admit he is from there. I asked him whats the word from your family over there and he just went off Obama is hated in Kenya big time. For trying to change there constitution. John hates Obama he went on a 20 minute rant on how Obama screwed this country up and was trying to do the same to Kenya.

John was going to move back to Kenya but now is waiting to see if the constitution changes.

wife got it a Dollar General, lol Sounds like he is hated every where now, even his home town :cheers:

What up with CNN. Are they buying into the Birther movement? Or are they just stoking the fire to get people to act crazy?

This story from CNN.

Before birther row, Lt. Col. Lakin racked up medals as flight surgeon

The article I found was not making this guy out to some crazy lunatic like most of them do. Does CNN know something we don't because I fully suspected a story bashing this guy into a pulp.

That was less biased than usual from a major news organization. The comments make me sick however, typical lib responses that "birthers" hate this country and black people. Blah.

Lt. Col. Lakin isn't going to get a fair shake, not unless he is tried in a civilian court. The military will not address the issue of obama's birth, even though it is the responsibility of the military to protect America from domestic and foreign threats, obams's birth IS an ISSUE and a possible threat to our country.