Defense Cuts to go deep

Not as far fetched as you may think. Having made note of the current administrations plans for the Defense Department, it's actually somewhat frightening. Don't get me wrong. I've been through budget cuts before, as have the other vets of this board. But none of us has ever seen what is coming.

SecDef Hagel, who is himself a Vietnam veteran stated recently, "These cuts are too fast, too abrupt and too irresponsible". He isn't just blowing smoke either. The Defense is already going to lose $500 billion over the next 10 years. That in itself, is going to be extremely painful. But current cuts already in motion are at $487 billion and growing.

As an example, we host a Marine Field Artillery Battalion, 4 times a year. We have the only land where they can fire 155mm guns. Even though we started a new budget on 1 October, they're already broke. They have no funds for training outside of their base. It's the same with the Army, Navy and Air Force.

Hagel goes on to say these cuts will cause an unnecessary, strategically unsound and dangerous degradation in military readiness and capability. He is correct. Letting our military strength atrophy would invite disaster. A large part of the military will lose its combat edge. As a result, it will be inevitable that some forces will be less prepared to act.

From 1980-2005, I spent my career doing one of two things. Either training for combat, or in combat. That's despite all the budget and personnel cuts mind you. NOTHING got in the way of training, except a national emergency, or combat.

The US military has long been the envy of the rest of the world, due to it's ability to train. We train to our doctrine, we train for multiple contingencies, we even make scenarios up and train for those as well. We are (currently) the most highly trained military force on the planet.

This is what Secretary Hagel is warning about. With no funding, the military cannot train. With no training, the military is just a disaster waiting to happen somewhere.

But I suspect his words are falling on deaf ears. The latest rumors coming out of the Pentagon, is the DoD is now looking at reducing proficiency requirements. That scares me just a bit. They've been waiving them for the last 5 years, and thus far, the only disasters (loss of life) have been the Army and Marines, and that's just using weapons. If this trend continues, it will get much, much worse.

Obama is going to make us as defenseless as possible before China comes marching in with his blessing to take over. Anything token force left of our military will have Mexican officers in command as well, in order to keep anybody from trying to resist.

Well, he did promise to "fundamentally transform the country." I guess that would qualify.

Bandit wrote:

Not as far fetched as you may think. Having made note of the current administrations plans for the Defense Department, it's actually somewhat frightening. Don't get me wrong. I've been through budget cuts before, as have the other vets of this board. But none of us has ever seen what is coming.

SecDef Hagel, who is himself a Vietnam veteran stated recently, "These cuts are too fast, too abrupt and too irresponsible". He isn't just blowing smoke either. The Defense is already going to lose $500 billion over the next 10 years. That in itself, is going to be extremely painful. But current cuts already in motion are at $487 billion and growing.

As an example, we host a Marine Field Artillery Battalion, 4 times a year. We have the only land where they can fire 155mm guns. Even though we started a new budget on 1 October, they're already broke. They have no funds for training outside of their base. It's the same with the Army, Navy and Air Force.

Hagel goes on to say these cuts will cause an unnecessary, strategically unsound and dangerous degradation in military readiness and capability. He is correct. Letting our military strength atrophy would invite disaster. A large part of the military will lose its combat edge. As a result, it will be inevitable that some forces will be less prepared to act.

From 1980-2005, I spent my career doing one of two things. Either training for combat, or in combat. That's despite all the budget and personnel cuts mind you. NOTHING got in the way of training, except a national emergency, or combat.

The US military has long been the envy of the rest of the world, due to it's ability to train. We train to our doctrine, we train for multiple contingencies, we even make scenarios up and train for those as well. We are (currently) the most highly trained military force on the planet.

This is what Secretary Hagel is warning about. With no funding, the military cannot train. With no training, the military is just a disaster waiting to happen somewhere.

But I suspect his words are falling on deaf ears. The latest rumors coming out of the Pentagon, is the DoD is now looking at reducing proficiency requirements. That scares me just a bit. They've been waiving them for the last 5 years, and thus far, the only disasters (loss of life) have been the Army and Marines, and that's just using weapons. If this trend continues, it will get much, much worse.

I joined in 1981 and I heard the horror stories from the older guys when Carter was president. It was not good. This is going to be Carter on steroids. They talked about ships not being able to get underway. Ships in disrepair. Jets not being able to fly for lack of parts. Moral was real low. I would hate to be in the military today under Obama. Bad enough I served under Clinton. Best years by far was Reagan. Training that is what happened when Carter sent in the rescue team in Iran. They had no training and no funds to train. It was a wreck waiting to happen.

Obama? You guys are killing me. Obama didn't do this. 533 clowns in DC did this, and are still doing it. Perhaps you've heard of them. They're called Congress.

1 October we were supposed to start a new budget, but Congress has not approved one. So the DoD has been forced to run on pure credit. They have cut massive amounts of personnel (furlough) where they can, cancelled training events (sequester), and it still isn't enough.

After Hagle ripped Congress a new arse, they called in the Joint Chiefs to see how much damage they have caused.

Military Joint Chiefs on Defense cuts

The key word is "unsustainable".

Obama? Obama got "bodyslammed" with this. He never saw it coming because it's never happened before. He found out over Syria just how bad it is.

Here we go again, it's Obama that refused to accept a budget unless he got everything, and more, that he wanted. And you know that. You can kiss his butt as much as you want, doesn't change the fact that Obama is solely responsible for the shutdown.

As far as defense spending, that is one thing Obama does want cut, and has been doing so ever since he was "elected". This would all be happening even if Obama had never forced a shutdown. But go ahead and blame it all on Congress, don't they know their duty is to simply rubber stamp anything and everything the tyrant wants? Apparently they don't, no wonder you blame them.

Well if you'd stop replying to things you know nothing about, there wouldn't be any "here we go again".

From the article I posted:

Quote :

"We in Congress created this monster, and we keep dragging you up to the Hill to tell us how much damage it has done," Udall said.

Gosh! Nothing about the Obama tyrant. Perhaps they don't know? :roll:

The worst blame to be placed is upon the Republicans in Congress.

And not just this time, either. Stalemate after stalemate, the Republicans agree to the Democrats desires 'cause the Democrats say they'll negotiate afterwards. And of course, they never do. But like naive little children, the Republicans just keep going along, expecting the Democrats to behave honorably.

What *should* have happened is that every single Republican in both the House AND the senate should have refused to sign off on the budget until Obamacare was defunded. I don't care if it took until hell freezes over. The Democrats cannot be trusted.

And as far as the debt ceiling goes, that should not be raised, period, regardless of the circumstances. This country can afford to pay its bills, we just have to stop handing free money out to every damned freeloader that comes down the pike.

Annoyed wrote:

The worst blame to be placed is upon the Republicans in Congress.

And not just this time, either. Stalemate after stalemate, the Republicans agree to the Democrats desires 'cause the Democrats say they'll negotiate afterwards.

That and Obama threatening to do things like end food stamps and blame it on the Republicans. They have no guts to stand up to Democrats making them look bad. All Obama has to do is go on tv and say it's the Republicans fault and clueless idiots believe it and report it as fact; "It's congress's fault, Obama said so!" Far to many people live in a fantasy world where Obama is the second coming. That's why they cave to blackmail, they have no guts to fight the "savior".

Pointing fingers is nice if you want to play partisan politics. I don't. This isn't about what's best for any party, it's about what's best for the nation. The defense budget is a "no brainer". We're not talking about funding some domestic program started by either party.

It doesn't matter if either Democrats or Republicans hold the majority of seats in Congress. What matters is Congress needs a fully functional, capable and ready military. Both parties have lost sight of this basic fact. Next year we start national elections. The Republicans are nervous, and the Democrats terrified. As they should be. The DoD isn't something you want to be mucking around with.

I agree America makes enough to pay our bills. I'd say more than enough. I do not know where it's all going, but clearly not where it should be.

Bandit wrote:

I agree America makes enough to pay our bills. I'd say more than enough. I do not know where it's all going, but clearly not where it should be.

I wasn't able to quickly find a nice pie chart that lays it out cleanly, the government hides things in categories like " Other mandatory spending", but we are spending at least 1/3, probably closer to half of the federal budget handing out money via various social service programs, social security, disability, etc.
If we are ever to get a handle on our budget problems that has to stop.

Legitimate SS retiree benefits shouldn't be touched, those people worked their lives out paying into the system and they shouldn't bear the brunt of our government's stupidity. I also have no problem with SHORT TERM temporary assistance to people who need it. Anyone can stumble once or twice in their journey through life. Nor do I have a problem with LEGITIMATE long term disability. But things like substance abuse & other behavioral problems do not qualify.

But we have billions of professional freeloaders, milking the various social service programs for all that they're worth. These people have no intention of ever supporting themselves, and very often its generational; one generation teaches its young that this is how you go through life. How many free cell phones are we providing to the leech class? That in itself is absurd! A Free Cell Phone as a government provided benefit?

These people often make poor life choices, such as screwing around in school or outright not attending, having children that they cannot possibly hope to provide for with no thought to the consequences of their behavior because they know the taxpayer will pick up the tab.

Right there is where the spending can be cut. Simply stop the free ride express cold. Everybody off! Start supporting yourself, go someplace else, or die by your own lack of effort. I don't care. Just stop expecting the government (TAXPAYERS) to provide for you.

Annoyed wrote:

we are spending at least 1/3, probably closer to half of the federal budget handing out money via various social service programs, social security, disability, etc.

We need to kick non citizens off of these programs for sure (and out of the country, but that's another story). Social Security retirement and Social Security Disability shouldn't even be part of that since that money was supposed to be collected, set aside, and used only for that purpose... but of course the fed raided and spent it so now they have to pay out on it as they go. SS and VA shouldn't be touched besides removing the illegals. Defense spending shouldn't be cut. But that doesn't leave much... for one the fed has NO right to be involved in education, that is Constitutionally solely up to the states. But that's only one percent of spending... which leaves the other area the fed has no legal business  being involved in, health care.

Unfortunately, I don't see how we can make any big cuts in that either. Ideally the fed would cut it 100% since they aren't supposed to be involved in it anyway. But then that would mean states would either have to just let people die by the thousands every week/day or raise state taxes through the roof or develop huge state debts to cover it.